How To Respond To a Female’s Neg

I found this post in Mystery’s forum. I thought it was quite good and can be used in the field often. The situation occurs alot, especially for me since I am a bit of a wise ass.

You got neg’d – Ohm’s FIN (“Female Initiated Neg”) Defense
hey guys,

CAVEAT: i havent searched the 1000s of posts on this forum yet, so i apologize in advance if someone has already thought of a routine similar to mine.

NOTE: all my routines have been time tested on the field on a regular basis by me and my buddies, so i’m not bs’ing u.

ok, here goes.

how often have u come across a “smart HB” (i know, it sounds like an oxymoron) who actually sent a few negs your way (aka “female initiated neg” ). these counter-backhanded compliments can be disasterous to a PUA’s game if not handled properly.

So i designed and perfected my FIN (female initiated neg) defense to combat the fallout from a negging HB (not to be confused with a nagging HB…different story altogether)

sometimes u may be spittin steller game, but then all of a sudden the girl throws a neg your way (or worse, her annoying mother hen of a friend does). u try to respond with something clever, but ur not that clever. this usually happens to those guys who use the same routines and openers all the time. they get so mechanical that they can’t adjust quickly enough when someone throws a wrench into the routine. they usually cough it up to the girl being a biatch or something else to make themselves feel better about themselves later. how pathetic. especially when u learn how easy it is to counter.

if anything, this should be one more reason why u shouldnt just shell out routine after routine. if your’re not varying your approaches then you’re not growing as a PUA.

remember this: a girl remembers everything that drops your status. if you dont learn damage control following a FIN, you’re status can drop significantly.

Now, without further ado…here’s what you do:


Clever targets can sometimes neg you, too (either on purpose or purely by accident).

It’s a evolutionary selection mechanism. She’s trying to make sure you’re the real deal. if you’re not more “powerful” than her, how can you be expected to “protect” her. it’s the evolutionary equivalent to a cavewomen hitting a caveman over the head with a club.

Foolproof damage control:

She just neg’d you and u dont have a clever response. it’s cool, don’t panic. not everyone has a comedian’s sense of common timing (if you do, then you may not need to read on). so you need a “catch all” counter neg to neutralize her.

Here’s the foolproof trick:

basically you want to slightly stall, reduce impact, and maintain alpha status

what do i mean? i mean buy some time while simultaneaously reducing the impact of the neg and reminding her who’s the boss. this works best at bars and clubs where the neg is accompanied by a background of music and chatter.

So…bam…the target just neg’d u. it was a good one, too. what do you do? you have 1 second to respond. well??…

ask the target to repeat herself…and this time LEAN IN JUST A LITTLE! Don’t lean in as though you’re the only one who wants to hear her. make sure you’re far enough away that she knows you want everyone to hear it again…but lean in just a little. your body language subconsciously tells her: “i’m the alpha male and i’m giving you a chance to speak.” and it’s also saying “Are you sure you’re as clever as you thought you were the first time you said that?”

Caution: don’t tilt your head as though you’re trying to get your ear closer. this will not convey alpha status, it’s too much of a genuine “i really didn’t hear you” response. after all, you already heard the neg the first time around. i know it’s instinctive to tilt, but it’s much more effective if you dont. remain erect. remember, the alpha is allowing the beta speak.

Obviously everyone, including her friends, heard what she said. that’s not the point. the place is loud. there is a high probability that u didn’t hear it. so have her repeat it.

trust me, it loses its originality and and timing the second time around.

Sidenote: (1) If her response starts off with a weak and unenthusiastic “I said [neg]” or “I just said [neg]” then you know you got her on the ropes. She’s unsure of her neg. she’s trying to revert everyone’s memory back to the first instance when she said it. she’s been weakened, this will be an easy KO. (2) If her response is repeated verbatim without being prefaced with “i said” OR if the “said” in “i said” was emphasized, then you’re dealing with a girl with high(er) self-esteem. not to worry, she, too, can be weakened. (3) if the repeated neg sounds better and more refined the second time, it means she’s especially smart and well-versed in FINs. so be weary of trying it again on her. but that’s not to say she still can’t be weakened this time around. (4) if she says “nevermind,” you should definitely egg her on to repeat herself! you don’t want to let her diffuse it because it will have left a deep stain. make her repeat it. say something like, “comon’, you havent said anything for while, and the one time u talk, i was distracted. so, what did u say?” (FYI, that’s a neg in and of itself)

Ok, so now she’s repeated herself. trust me, it won’t be as funny to her friends the second time around either. now her and her friends are silent…they’re waiting for your response. now they all need validation.

Don’t stall any longer. don’t ask for another repeat. and definitely don’t, at any point along the FIN, preface your response with a paraphrase of what she just said (otherwise, it would unconscious tell her she got to you. or she may think you’re repeating it to buy time.) Oh, and don’t repeat it in the form of a question. you’re not on jeopardy. that’s a classic sign of stalling and unpreparedness.

ok, so they’re waiting for validation….

pause briefly, as if it only took a second to process it.

then quickly say something that conveys the mildest of validations, like “clever,” “cute,” or my favorite “okay.” say it quickly, don’t draw it out, it’ll come off as a stalling tactic. remember, you want to be quick on the trigger after the FIN has been repeated. any hesitation means she got to you.

after u give your quick mild validation, quickly turn to the friend closest to her (or if the friend neg’d u, turn to the target) and lean in, this time, a little further in, this is meant to be a repoire between just u and the other girl. now you’re reduce the impact by counter-negging and, at the same time, conveying a loss of loyalty. how and what do i mean by this? you’re gonna be throwing out your own counter neg, followed by something that will force a smile from the other girl.

imagine the following… girl#1 negs. u say repeat. you lean in (but remain erect). #1 repeats. u say “okay.” lean in further to girl #2. counter-neg to #2 followed by something that’ll get #2 to force a smile.

now #1 hasn’t heard what u said to #2. the neg initiator is still waiting for her validation. instead, u blow her off and say something to her friend that makes the friend smile/laugh.

oh oh, she thinks: he neutralized my neg. even worse, my homegirl is on his side. i(t’s all subconscious but it’s there. )

so what exactly did you say to the other girl?

simple. you reestablish your dominance. if you have a really good counter neg. use it. but most of the time you won’t. not to worry…u continue to convey confidence. now all you do is repeat one of your better recent negs. so while you’re leaning into #2, just say any of the following:

“i think she didn’t like it when i said [your earlier neg]. Does she always take herself so seriously?” (this might even elicit a nod from the other girl =D) that’ll really piss off the neg initiator since she didn’t hear what you told her friend.

OR try these…

“i just finished telling her [your earlier neg] and all she can say is [her neg]” (this implies: “my neg was better”)

now these responses aren’t usually enough to elicit a smiling/laughing response from your “new best friend.” so continue to whisper something that’ll get her to smile or nod…anything that increases your value.

what’s the best way to do this? just say something that forces the behavior. it’s not meant to be funny. it’s meant to trigger a social response that she’s programmed to do.

sound difficult? it’s not!

all you gotta do is give the tiniest of compliments about the neg initiator to your “new best friend.”

she’s her friend, right? she’s gotta smile, laugh, etc. It’s what girls do for one another.

do this…follow your counterneg immediatly with something like.

“don’t tell your friend, but i think it’s really cute the way she wiggled her nose when she said that.” 9 times out of ten things like this elicit at least a little smile.

(“your friend” in the previous example can be replaced with “her” but never with the actual name of the girl. i find using her name in this scenario tends to convey that she has power) look what happened…u detracted from the FIN, threw in your own neg, reminded the friend to maintain your secrecy, elicited a validating response, and the neg initiator still doesn’t know what’s going on.)

You may also try:

“don’t tell your friend, but her crudeness is kinda turning me on” OR
“I like clever people. I’m guessing she’s naturally like this cause it didn’t sound rehearsed.” OR
“dont tell your friend, but i think its cute the way she’s always playing with her hair when she’s thinking of something clever to say. But dont say anything, i don’t even think she notices she’s doing it.”

i like the preface “dont tell your friend.” it helps to divide loyalties. obviously, she’ll tell her later, but by then it doesn’t matter.

note: depending on whether you’re talking to the target or the target’s friend you gotta adjust your response. the last thing u want to do is make the target think u like her friend.

did she really wiggle her nose? did she really play with her hair when she was thinking? who cares. the friend won’t know. she’ll take your word for it. she was too busy listening to her homegirl’s neg. but, wow, you on teh other hand, despite being dissed were still intuitive and aware of your surroundings. remember, she’s socially programmed to respond positively to “compliments” about her friend. she doesnt think she’s betraying anyone. alpha status regained.

notice how the statements were all closed. the natural resopnse is probably just a “yes” or a “nod” or a “smile/laugh.” you don’t want your “new best friend” to talk. it’ll ruin the mystery of what u just said to her. remember it was your own private repoire. (you may have guessed its easiest to do this when there’re only two girls involved, but with practice this can be done in groups and the target can still be left out.)

now, here’s the kicker…the next thing to come out of the neg initiator’s mouth is usually: “what did he say?”

dont let it get to that. u dont want your new best friend to open her mouth. sometimes this happens too fast to prevent it. that’s why i throw in the “dont tell your friend” preface…9 times out of 10 the friend will just say somethign like “nothing” or “it was stupid.” that’s a good thing because it’ll really make the neg initiator think that her friend’s on your side. if the friend doesn’t say something like that, then u might want to say it to remind the friend to stay quiet.

if you’re lucky enough to cut off the “what did he say?,” then just launch into a new routine ASAP. and the mystery of your short interaction with the friend will remain. the routine at this point doesnt matter as much as the timing does. all ur trying to do is keep that rift open. which routine? c-shaped smiles vs. u-shaped smiles, cube on the road, best friends test, it doesn’t really matter. you’re just trying to keep the other biatch guessing about what you said. she’ll be dwelling so much on it that she probably wont be paying attention (which will probably set u up to give anothe neg. i.e. “focus babe, u seem confused.”)

i bet she’ll think twice before trying another FIN against a PUA again!

Let’s do an example:

AFC: blah blah…you’re finger’s are so cute the way they’re short and stubby.
Target: haha…i’m sure you know all about short and stubby appendages.
AFC: oooh, burn…you’re funny, that’s f*ck’d up. blah, blah, blah (no real comeback)

same scenario:
PUA: blah blah…you’re finger’s are so cute the way they’re short and stubby.
Target: haha…i’m sure you know all about short and stubby appendages.
PUA (leaning in): i can’t hear you.
Target: you heard me.
PUA: i really didnt hear. you tend to muffle your words a little. [neg 1]
Target: i said: i’m sure you know all about short and stubby appendages!
PUA: oh…okay…(now leaning into her friend’s ear)…i didn’t know she was so self-conscious about her fingers…don’t tell her, but i actually thought it was cute the way she was wrapping her hair around her fingers when she was thinking that up.
Target’s friend: (smiling) yeah…
Target: what’d he…
PUA: (cutting her off)…listen, i’m going to take a guess that you’re both scorpios. you seem to have a strong connection…of course, i don’t really believe in that stuff.

You did it!!

i live for FINers. they make the game more interesting.

remember, practice makes perfect. With time it’ll become second nature. try conforming it to derivative scenarios involving groups, AMOGs, and repeat FINers. if you find this useful in the field (and you will) i’d love to hear about it. Good luck!


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About Bobby Rio I'm Bobby Rio, one of the founders of TSB. I tend to write about what is on my mind so you'll find a mix of self development, social dynamics and dating articles/experiences.  For a collection of some of my favorite articles check them out.